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Old 02-04-2009, 01:33 AM   #31
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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Originally Posted by LOT 737-300 View Post
Well, I'd say it's safe for both the US and UK youth, possibly more from the UK side in my opinion, though that is because they seemed to have joined in larger numbers (either that, or managed to post more.) I was always boggled by why most of their posts look like to have been typed up on a cell phone using cell phone message limits. I will admit, some of the "offending members" have improved greatly since they first posted.
Twoja Polski jest coraz lepsza, nie sądzisz?



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Old 02-04-2009, 01:46 AM   #32
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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I hate to give you an answer. It'll get political and then no one will like me again and I am trying to get birthday gifts so I'll keep my mouth shut.
I know exactly what you are going to say Cap... You need not say more... I shall continue to follow the ways of the force!
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Old 02-04-2009, 01:48 AM   #33
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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Originally Posted by Digital View Post
Let's keep in mind this is a messege board, not a term paper. It's one of the lowest, crudest forms of writeing one can possibly publish on the web. I'm a teacher, and I normally have to police grammer 2/3rds of the day. Here I couldn't care less, in fact its nice to have a place where I can relax, chat, and even bicker without having to go over my text more than once.

That being said, sometimes for the sake of clarity and even sanity, people just need to type clearly enough to be understood. It's true we have an international messege board, with people from many countries, levels of english comprehension, and age so its impossible to expect impeccable posting. Still, a resonable amount of observation of the rules of the english language (as that is the lingua franca of this board) is expected. Furry's post should be observed by all.

I also think its funny how often the worst spelling offenders are the American youth who frequent this site, rather than the international members, whose english is'nt their first language.
Ouch!

It's funny though, most of kids here who want to be pilots don't have good spelling or grammar. And believe me from prior experience, during an interview you will be tested on these things. They want to see if your intelligence matches your degree. I was tested in spelling, grammar, mathematics and science in addition to aviation related material during my 2 day interview with TWA. It was very hard. I have friends who fly with major airlines and from what I hear it is pretty standard during the interview process. That's why I harp on these kids to sharpen up because you are judged by the words you use.

I think that the quality of education isn't what it was when I was in school. It seems to me that teachers are afraid to tell kids they're wrong. They don't want to bruise their tender egos. If you think 4 + 4 equals 15 it's ok, you get a gold star little Johnnie, at least you tried. And I hear that many teachers are teaching politics and political views and agendas such as global warming and what-not. That's just what I hear. Don't beat up the messenger.



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Old 02-04-2009, 02:19 AM   #34
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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Twoja Polski jest coraz lepsza, nie sądzisz?
This is the worst spelling I've ever seen
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Old 02-04-2009, 02:35 AM   #35
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Re: Spelling and grammar

Quite observation, everyone here is happy to blame the school system for letting down these guys but what about the parents?

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Originally Posted by Captain Wahoo View Post
It seems to me that teachers are afraid to tell kids they're wrong. They don't want to bruise their tender egos.
I think they should bring the "Cane" back into secondary schools. By the Cane, I mean "Coke".
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Old 02-04-2009, 03:54 AM   #36
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Re: Spelling and grammar

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital View Post
Let's keep in mind this is a messege board, not a term paper. It's one of the lowest, crudest forms of writeing one can possibly publish on the web. I'm a teacher, and I normally have to police grammer 2/3rds of the day. Here I couldn't care less, in fact its nice to have a place where I can relax, chat, and even bicker without having to go over my text more than once.

That being said, sometimes for the sake of clarity and even sanity, people just need to type clearly enough to be understood. It's true we have an international messege board, with people from many countries, levels of english comprehension, and age so its impossible to expect impeccable posting. Still, a resonable amount of observation of the rules of the english language (as that is the lingua franca of this board) is expected. Furry's post should be observed by all.

I also think its funny how often the worst spelling offenders are the American youth who frequent this site, rather than the international members, whose english is'nt their first language.
I know that I am being cruel now, but your post contains 11 grammatical mistakes and 5 spelling errors! I hope you are not an English teacher.
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Old 02-04-2009, 03:58 AM   #37
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Re: Spelling and grammar

Ok I can understand that some don't spell well and grammar's bad. But getting into people's signature's etc is getting ridiculous. If they're distracting, don't look at them! On the radio today, there was a woman talking about how people start correcting other people's spelling and grammar when they're stressed at work. Weird but I guess its true. And we shouldn't forget that we're from all over the world and the language and grammar varies.
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Old 02-04-2009, 04:11 AM   #38
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Re: Spelling and grammar

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Wahoo View Post
Ouch!

It's funny though, most of kids here who want to be pilots don't have good spelling or grammar. And believe me from prior experience, during an interview you will be tested on these things. They want to see if your intelligence matches your degree. I was tested in spelling, grammar, mathematics and science in addition to aviation related material during my 2 day interview with TWA. It was very hard. I have friends who fly with major airlines and from what I hear it is pretty standard during the interview process. That's why I harp on these kids to sharpen up because you are judged by the words you use.

I think that the quality of education isn't what it was when I was in school. It seems to me that teachers are afraid to tell kids they're wrong. They don't want to bruise their tender egos. If you think 4 + 4 equals 15 it's ok, you get a gold star little Johnnie, at least you tried. And I hear that many teachers are teaching politics and political views and agendas such as global warming and what-not. That's just what I hear. Don't beat up the messenger.
Thanks for catching me on those errors. I know it looks bad coming from someone whoís supposed to be teaching this nationís youth to not make those mistakes. To be honest I hate grammar, but enforce it enough when teaching. Iíve also been spoiled by auto correcting word processors, which have caused a serious lapse in skills. These days I teach German, and Iím more familiar with that side of grammar. I have taught English in the past, and may again in the future. Like I said earlier, on sites like this I'm fairly laid back.
fficeffice" />
I started out substitute teaching out of college, and then moved up to contract teaching before I went back for my masters. Now I teach German at the university level. Substituting was fun for me, because you encounter just about everything, from the very best to the very worst. I also encountered some of the concerns you mention. Iíve taught Science in several different levels, Global Warming is typically talked about and appears in the text books Iíve worked with, generally referring to the subject of Climate Change. Climate change is a definite part of the curriculum in the state of California, there really is no avoiding that, and for good reason.

As far as politics in the classroom, itís a very thin line. Typically, on the University level it is considered unethical to spread a particular political or religious viewpoint in the classroom. Spreading politics is widely frowned upon, even on the high school level. However, it is acceptable to talk about any subject matter of any nature in the classroom, so long as itís talked about in a constructive manner, and not preached. At least thatís the case at Universities. In public schools thatís another matter, there is a list of things youíre prohibited from talking about, such as supportive theories of anti-Semitism, and holocaust-denial, most shockingly Marxism, Communism, and Socialism, those words are absolutely taboo. Basically all youíre allowed to say is ďKarl Marx was born in Germany in 1818, and died in 1883; he is the founder of Communist Theory.Ē As an Educator Iím a massive proponent of free speech, everything should be open to discussion, period, and no excuses. Iím appalled by the fact there are prohibited materials, especially Marx. Everybody knows his political philosophy is antiquated and discredited, but still youíre not allowed to talk about his influence. Thanks a lot McCarthy.

Of course teachers teach politics, but even in high school and below itís seen as unethical to present a particular view as correct. In the academic scene, thatís not going to fly for a minute. Typically when talking about a contemporary political issue such as, in todayís news, Angelika Merkels admonishment of the pope, which deals with a case of holocaust denial, and free speech in Germany. In this case itís my job to moderate the discussion, and be informed of relevant information. You present one side, and the other, and that is discussed. Most of the time you follow the model, Thesis =>Antithesis => Synthesis, other times youíre not going for synthesis at all, itís about the juxtaposition of pro and con and itís the ensuing dialogue that matters. Polemics is also a rhetorical tool we use sometimes, and we as grad students are instructed to formulate one argument for discussions sake, but itís only a tool, even though we encourage our students to be able to think in those terms, when applicable, as academic writing is often to present a convincing case, and we need to be able to do that. I am a strong believer in academic freedom, EVERYthing should be open to discussion, or else the education system is impaired.

In most colleges and universities you will probably lose your job if you tell a student to vote for a particular candidate. Political views do get expressed, or can be inferred, but its bad mojo to talk about them even outside the classroom or off the record, but it happens. Dispite going to a liberal college, perhaps one of the most liberal in the country, there was no pushing of beliefs by any of the faculty, granted some views where assumed to be true, but I always found the faculty where quite eager to discuss the contrary or conservative argument as well, in fact they encouraged it. Ironically the most politically vocal faculty member at that college, my Sociology Teacher, was a conservative. He really did push his views almost every day, he eventually got in trouble and was dismissed from the school because he said something nasty about Arabs, it still directed a lot of press attention to the school, which was then criticized for being hostile to conservative points of view, however, he was just an ***.
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Old 02-04-2009, 04:12 AM   #39
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Re: Spelling and grammar

In all seriousness, I have only one view on this. I encourage my children to do their best at whatever they tackle. It behoves one to take pride in their work, whatever that may be. Generally, it reflects how much one cares.

In the case of these forums, nobody will die or suffer serious harm from poor spelling or grammar. Like Captain Wahoo, I believe I have a responsibility to set a good example to the younger members and encourage them, without being nasty or derogatory. There are many walks of life where mistakes are not tolerated, even though we all make them. An air traffic controller or a ship's captain would be good examples of this.

As a high school student, my mathematics teacher took my class out to Monash University on a visit to the faculty of Civil Engineering. We were shown the mangled remnants of the Westgate bridge which had collapsed with loss of lives. The reason behind the collapse? The architects that had performed the design had not re-checked all their figures for the structural loads and the re-inforced concrete was out by a factor of about 10. The moral of the story was that we should always re-check every calculation.

That is an extreme example but it certainly made an impression upon me. Whether one is an athlete or a brain surgeon, to reach the top of one's chosen field requires some exactitude. That does not mean that the forums have to be anal-retentive, but it never hurt anyone to try just a little, even if only as a show of respect to fellow members of the forum.
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Old 02-04-2009, 04:40 AM   #40
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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Originally Posted by flyingdoc View Post
In all seriousness, I have only one view on this. I encourage my children to do their best at whatever they tackle. It behoves one to take pride in their work, whatever that may be. Generally, it reflects how much one cares.

In the case of these forums, nobody will die or suffer serious harm from poor spelling or grammar. Like Captain Wahoo, I believe I have a responsibility to set a good example to the younger members and encourage them, without being nasty or derogatory. There are many walks of life where mistakes are not tolerated, even though we all make them. An air traffic controller or a ship's captain would be good examples of this.

As a high school student, my mathematics teacher took my class out to Monash University on a visit to the faculty of Civil Engineering. We were shown the mangled remnants of the Westgate bridge which had collapsed with loss of lives. The reason behind the collapse? The architects that had performed the design had not re-checked all their figures for the structural loads and the re-inforced concrete was out by a factor of about 10. The moral of the story was that we should always re-check every calculation.

That is an extreme example but it certainly made an impression upon me. Whether one is an athlete or a brain surgeon, to reach the top of one's chosen field requires some exactitude. That does not mean that the forums have to be anal-retentive, but it never hurt anyone to try just a little, even if only as a show of respect to fellow members of the forum.

I think that’s a very good example. There is a time and place for exactness, in every field.

I think in this case, I can make another example.



A woman without her man is nothing.
A woman, without her, man is nothing.

Here you can see how a little bit of grammar changes the entire meaning. Two additional commas change the entire meaning of the sentence around.
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Old 02-04-2009, 11:08 AM   #41
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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Originally Posted by ek&sq View Post
Ok I can understand that some don't spell well and grammar's bad. But getting into people's signature's etc is getting ridiculous. If they're distracting, don't look at them! On the radio today, there was a woman talking about how people start correcting other people's spelling and grammar when they're stressed at work. Weird but I guess its true. And we shouldn't forget that we're from all over the world and the language and grammar varies.
So everyone in the UK now types and writes as if were done as a Cell phone SMS?

Scary

As for Signatures, I don't care what people put in them, as long as they're not freaking huge photos.
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Old 02-04-2009, 02:05 PM   #42
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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Originally Posted by Chard View Post
Quite observation, everyone here is happy to blame the school system for letting down these guys but what about the parents?



I think they should bring the "Cane" back into secondary schools. By the Cane, I mean "Coke".
I was going to rant about parents too, but you guys I'm sure, get sick of my rants.



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Old 02-04-2009, 02:08 PM   #43
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Re: Spelling and grammar

Digital, you wouldn't happen to be my English teacher would you?
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Old 02-04-2009, 02:15 PM   #44
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Re: Spelling and grammar

Digital, I think that’s a very good example. I like that!

By the way, I can give you many examples as to why global warming is the biggest hoax known to mankind that will cost us all billions of dollars. Nothing political just cold, hard, real science facts. And not science from scientists being paid by any political organization either. This coming from a person who has extensive studies in science, meteorology and astronomy. That's me!

Too bad schools won't allow a counterview, only the view AlGore wants everyone to see so he can fatten his pockets. He's fat enough as it is. Unfortunately that is the start of socialism, start the kids off young with propaganda. Again that is political and I don't to debate politics again. Then my approval rating goes down and I won't win that Wings900 popularity contest and the $1000 worth of Inflight 200 models that goes along with it.



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Last edited by Captain Wahoo; 02-04-2009 at 02:27 PM.
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Old 02-04-2009, 03:46 PM   #45
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Re: Spelling and grammar

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'the ulimate pizzel book'
Now that is funny. Of course he should have written 'The Ultimate Pizzle Book'.
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