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Old 03-15-2012, 05:32 PM   #166
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

Talking about veterans,is furry still on holiday stateside or has he emigrated?...
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:28 AM   #167
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

I have followed this thread for a long time, without commenting.
I am NOT a wings900 veteran.
I AM an old guy, though.

Two observations; Despite the FACT that this thread was posted under the 1/400th scale heading, the VETERANS have clogged it up with a LOT of general aviation talk, which, IMHO, is arrogance. AND, most hobbies, such as model railroading, would die for an influx of teen participants.

And I thought teens whined a lot! LOL
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Old 04-02-2012, 10:57 PM   #168
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by modernrat View Post
I have followed this thread for a long time, without commenting.
I am NOT a wings900 veteran.
I AM an old guy, though.

Two observations; Despite the FACT that this thread was posted under the 1/400th scale heading, the VETERANS have clogged it up with a LOT of general aviation talk, which, IMHO, is arrogance. AND, most hobbies, such as model railroading, would die for an influx of teen participants.

And I thought teens whined a lot! LOL
I wouldn't say that, I see a fair amount of all ages at the model railroad shows I go to. In fact, I think it may be the other way around in this case! One might argue price shuts out less affluent younger folks, but when you consider at trade shows and ebay, a very good Atlas or Kato Unit can be picked up for 35 bucks (as opposed to the 60-100 they'd usually go for). A lot of the older people are losing interest slowly in collecting the models of airlienrs. Not only for the choice (though that isn't too bad actually), but more from other factors too, specifically the cost had been getting out of hand with some manufactures. When you have a large and healthy hobby, like the model RR stuff, the cost can be more easily controlled, especially as there is always something new, and people end up buying stuff at shows (which tend to be great places to get good stuff for cheap.) Outside of Chicago, LA or Seattle, I can only think of ONE other trade show in model airliners in the US, and that is Airliners International, and that's a show that only occurs once a year, at one city a year. The model RR hobby OTOH, I can likely think of a MASSIVE book of shows, including some in my area that happen a couple times a year, including World's Greatest hobby on tour (which visits a fair amount of towns a year), the Great train Expo, which tends to cover most metropolitan areas and various small time stuff. I'm just going to stop at that, as conclusions can be drawn from that. Though both hobbies are suffering badly these days, and for similar reasons (production issues, QC slip ups, prices becoming too much to bear (though for trains, not so bad as shows have many good quality 2nd hand stuff for just a couple dollars sometimes, wouldn't been able to complete my late Amtrak Rainbow era consist without that advantage), just to name a few).

If you look at the thread though, it dates back to a certain period in 2008 when there was a specific member who was at the time causing all sorts of chaos, and while most of the members were trying to get him to stop, the admins (who were the only forms of active moderator ship then, no Rep system here then too), were usually too busy, and the only admin (now former) pretty much told us to go suck a **** and we were being arrogant elitists. So most of us more or less did a small boycott, proving that if it wasn't us, eventually other members would soon grow agitated at him (which did happen.) What followed was likely the next year of crap from him with multiple accounts. Eventually due to this specific member's actions and trying to circumvent his multiple bans and such, the admins finally gave in and took the advice of most of the board and put in Mods to help keep the place from falling into a Wild West Saloon, and the rep system as well (I guess something they decided to implement to help the 1 Line "Cool Airport" or "me too" posts). Those two actions are very likely what had improved quality by a tenfold! Where is this GenAv talk that has been clogging up the thread? I've scanned through all the posts, and it seems it is on topic (granted, it could have worked better on Squawk Talk. But given the times and circumstances, it too did a decent job here at the time.)

The site these days, it isn't too bad. Sometimes there will be a member here or there that drives people up a wall, but I find it much easier to get along with people. Most of the problems we have seen with the site involving squabbles between membership, for the most part, are in the past.

Hope you didn't mind my observations on that. You have to bear in mind that most of the insanity from that time is buried somewhere in the forum, sometimes deleted or moved to an area not accessible by normal members.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:26 AM   #169
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by modernrat View Post
. AND, most hobbies, such as model railroading, would die for an influx of teen participants.
Well that's what happened here, a tonne of kids came on and made the place a McDonalds.
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Old 04-03-2012, 12:02 PM   #170
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

I don't think kids have anything to do with people moving onto something else or changes in priorities, lack of time etc... wait for the winter, you'll probably see more participation I hope.
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Old 04-03-2012, 07:00 PM   #171
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

Lot wrote; "If you look at the thread though, it dates back to a certain period in 2008 when there was a specific member who was at the time causing all sorts of chaos,"


Really, wahoo was referring to ONE member?

As far as I know, anyone can start a Yahoo group, and restrict membership. Why doesn't wahoo just do that, and invite the "veterans?"

Since entering the hobby 19 months ago, I have bought 58 planes and a wings900 t-shirt. I am not a "veteran," but I am an "old guy." Old guys and teenagers are totally different types of people, and, while I am an "old guy," I never want to be a "grumpy old guy."


Also, by page two of this thread, the "veterans" were making insipid completely off-topic posts. It almost appears the "veterans" think this is THEIR board and rules don't apply to them, which is complete arrogance. It appears the "veterans" think that THEIR off-topic posts are something THEY are entitled to. Off-topic posts are OK as long as the "judge and jury veterans" are the ones making the insipid posts.

My point; wahoo sounds like a grumpy, arrogant old man. And, I don't really like reading the insipid off-topic posts by the "veterans." Why do "veterans" make off-topic, insipid posts? Because they feel these are THEIR boards.

Last edited by modernrat; 04-03-2012 at 07:17 PM.
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Old 04-04-2012, 01:24 AM   #172
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by modernrat View Post
Lot wrote; "If you look at the thread though, it dates back to a certain period in 2008 when there was a specific member who was at the time causing all sorts of chaos,"


Really, wahoo was referring to ONE member?

As far as I know, anyone can start a Yahoo group, and restrict membership. Why doesn't wahoo just do that, and invite the "veterans?"

Since entering the hobby 19 months ago, I have bought 58 planes and a wings900 t-shirt. I am not a "veteran," but I am an "old guy." Old guys and teenagers are totally different types of people, and, while I am an "old guy," I never want to be a "grumpy old guy."


Also, by page two of this thread, the "veterans" were making insipid completely off-topic posts. It almost appears the "veterans" think this is THEIR board and rules don't apply to them, which is complete arrogance. It appears the "veterans" think that THEIR off-topic posts are something THEY are entitled to. Off-topic posts are OK as long as the "judge and jury veterans" are the ones making the insipid posts.

My point; wahoo sounds like a grumpy, arrogant old man. And, I don't really like reading the insipid off-topic posts by the "veterans." Why do "veterans" make off-topic, insipid posts? Because they feel these are THEIR boards.
Believe me man, this one guy was really that bad at the time. It was literally starting to drive away members, sure new people can help make the board, but without the older membership, things can start to fall apart. Not old guys, but teens were also growing very very short tempered of him too! Quality of the discussions had fallen badly around that time as certain people tried to make it acceptable to have posts that read like a text message (jst wndring, do u wanna read a bord tat reads lik tis?) There were a few other members that started up around this time, he may have been referring to, and I believe some still post here but most of them learned the norms of the forum and adjusted well to it. Every forum is like this, and when certain folks run and ruin the atmosphere of the forum, members will get pissed.

Anyways, no one is making it seem like that, people just don't want to turn the board into another DAC, which was the trend at the time.

You obviously haven't spent enough time on the board to see now that things are a lot better, for both the teen (who in your mind, are oppressed by grumpy old men (never mind that some guys in this thread were/still are teens that are agreeing with Wahoo. I myself was only like 19 myself when the thread started, not a teen in the traditional sense, but still) ) and the older folks. There are still some squabbles that break out, but it rarely is anything based on age and more based on certain ideas and such, and in the end, both sides end up agreeing to disagree with honor and dignity.

Trust me, anyone who was on the board those times, will tell you, the thread made perfect sense. Things were getting too out of hand. You likely wouldn't understand unless you read the threads from then understanding that the quality controls on the forum now (like our awesome and alert mod staff) and the rep system have changed things for the better.

I should state at one point, and everyone who defends one-liner spammers seems to bring this up this rather hypocritical fallacy in logic, which I guess can be called the "If you older guys don't like it, leave and make your own forum" fallacy. If you feel that this board isn't too friendly to you, and the longer time members are too rough on you, why not try taking your own advice and inviting those members you feel are so oppressed by us, the grumpy, old and arrogant veterans?

If you actually read any of Wahoo's posts (especially outside this thread (which reading your description of him, I doubt it)) you'd see he was not being the "get off my lawn" old man, but a member, who does care about the forum. He, along with many other members had tried to avoid getting into any type of confrontation with the members. I will admit, I'm very guilty of fitting into your description of Brian than Brian is. But for many of us, Wings was more or less a second home, and a great place to have an intelligent and readable discussion on aviation topics. I'm reading your post, and to be honest, I fail to really see your point, as conditions now are very different. There are not really any members that post here like mindless drones here anymore. It wasn't so much an age question (as you make it seem) but a quality question. The wings of 2012 is much improved from the wings of 2008, when airflorid54/americanairlines/whatevernamehechosethatmonth a few chronies of his were causing all sorts of chaos on the forum, and making it resemble a cross between 4chan's /b/ section and a short bus.

Beside, a little off topic sillyness (what goes on in a lot of the thread here mind you) is not bad, everyone does it and is more than welcome to join in. It's when certain other conditions are met, then it starts to upset most people.
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Old 04-04-2012, 05:21 AM   #173
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Re: Whatever happened to the veterans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by modernrat View Post
Lot wrote; "If you look at the thread though, it dates back to a certain period in 2008 when there was a specific member who was at the time causing all sorts of chaos,"


Really, wahoo was referring to ONE member?

As far as I know, anyone can start a Yahoo group, and restrict membership. Why doesn't wahoo just do that, and invite the "veterans?"

Since entering the hobby 19 months ago, I have bought 58 planes and a wings900 t-shirt. I am not a "veteran," but I am an "old guy." Old guys and teenagers are totally different types of people, and, while I am an "old guy," I never want to be a "grumpy old guy."


Also, by page two of this thread, the "veterans" were making insipid completely off-topic posts. It almost appears the "veterans" think this is THEIR board and rules don't apply to them, which is complete arrogance. It appears the "veterans" think that THEIR off-topic posts are something THEY are entitled to. Off-topic posts are OK as long as the "judge and jury veterans" are the ones making the insipid posts.

My point; wahoo sounds like a grumpy, arrogant old man. And, I don't really like reading the insipid off-topic posts by the "veterans." Why do "veterans" make off-topic, insipid posts? Because they feel these are THEIR boards.
I can't think of any good reason why anyone would need to criticize and insult people for things that have been written FOUR years ago, especially if the individual has not even been around when this thread was started.

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